tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post7176337187815507236..comments2024-03-27T13:09:26.512+05:30Comments on E=mc^2: Kashmir exposes IndiaSujaihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comBlogger31125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-62225927900989940602012-12-08T10:06:29.534+05:302012-12-08T10:06:29.534+05:30India has to sober up, become mature, and start ac...India has to sober up, become mature, and start acting like a rational adult instead of a bigoted loony high on opium.<br /><br />wow. I wonder why our entire litany of higher authorities are not as clever as you are. Why don't you infiltrate into the higher ranks of our administration and affect some real good change and teach the great country called India how to be rational and not be a relegated bigot?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-38657963730469150832012-11-30T18:21:03.385+05:302012-11-30T18:21:03.385+05:30Sujal K crocodile tear for muslim but hard dick fo...Sujal K crocodile tear for muslim but hard dick for hindu women,only lumpen has such quality,he forget hindus in pakistan and bangladesh and muslim migration in India,tell me who want pakistan?After creation pakistan 30% extra people from pakistan enter India only for religion,but shameless muslim not went to their love Pakistan,only word Hypocrite.greatprophet1https://www.blogger.com/profile/09619623615240913155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-5970662278365082592011-10-31T13:18:55.964+05:302011-10-31T13:18:55.964+05:30Rags: awesome comments.
I agree with almost every...Rags: awesome comments.<br /><br />I agree with almost everything Sujai says on this blog, except his bullshit views on Kashmir. <br /><br />You have answered Sujai's points very well.Vinaynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-2357477649871650422008-08-30T04:15:00.000+05:302008-08-30T04:15:00.000+05:30That does not mean I should have my allegiances to...<I>That does not mean I should have my allegiances towards Kashmiri Pandits blindly just because they are like my family. <BR/></I><BR/>--<BR/>I don't think I mentioned "blind allegiance towards Kashmiri Pandits" anywhere in my comments. Classic case of mis-characterization. Please read my comments once more.<BR/>================================<BR/><I>Maturity involves thinking a bit objectively. It’s not that tough to know about a topic objectively if we throw down our insecurities, prejudices and subjectivities. I try my best.</I><BR/>--<BR/>*laughing*<BR/>For someone who has only very recently woken up (or mustered up the courage) and started writing about Islamic terrorism (and that too almost always accompanied by some Hindutva violence in an attempt to appear "fair-and-balanced") - something that the world has known since the days of Satanic Verses - it's clear that you still have lots of mature work to do. Keep at it though.<BR/>-chirkutAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-4261549230919382722008-08-30T01:36:00.000+05:302008-08-30T01:36:00.000+05:30Chirkut:Spoke too soon,Me too! ;-)Chirkut:<BR/><BR/><I>Spoke too soon,</I><BR/><BR/>Me too! ;-)Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-67175359632877712742008-08-30T01:34:00.000+05:302008-08-30T01:34:00.000+05:30Chirkut:Must be a recent development that concern ...Chirkut:<BR/><I>Must be a recent development that concern for Kashmiri Hindus rose up Sujai's list of priorities, because that concern is definitely not reflected in the number of posts on this blog.</I><BR/><BR/>A blog is only one facet of a person’s life. A person is much more than his blog. He cannot be completely captured by his blog.<BR/><BR/>Just because I have not expressed my sympathies for Kashmiri Pandits ON THIS BLOG does not mean I do not sympathize with them. <BR/><BR/>In the same way, just because I sympathize with Kashmiri Muslims does not mean I am against Kashmiri Pandits. <BR/><BR/>Unfortunately, I do not see the world in black and white. There are too many shades of gray. <BR/><BR/>I have known Kashmiri Pandits before I knew about Kashmir. I have my best friends who are Kashmiri Pandits and they form a part of my life. In fact, I don't know a Kashmiri Muslim so closely.<BR/><BR/>That does not mean I should have my allegiances towards Kashmiri Pandits blindly just because they are like my family. <BR/><BR/>Maturity involves thinking a bit objectively. It’s not that tough to know about a topic objectively if we throw down our insecurities, prejudices and subjectivities. I try my best. <BR/><BR/>[I am not sure why I am writing about myself here. Each time I do it, I give more room for some idiots to make a mockery of my personal life.]Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-52331256611084036862008-08-30T01:26:00.000+05:302008-08-30T01:26:00.000+05:30Spoke too soon, without reading the comments betwe...Spoke too soon, without reading the comments between rags and Sujai. It's the same old pseudo-secular Sujai, more concerned for Mr. Hussein's silly paintings than Kashmiri Hindus losing their homes. Priorities, I guess.<BR/><BR/>Oh, and Sujai, using emoticons is no way to wiggle out of an argument - that's called intellectual dishonesty. And then you accuse others of being irrational - look in the mirror first.<BR/>"Thotha chana baaje ghana" is more apt for you.<BR/>-chirkutAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-50586150323858499472008-08-30T01:13:00.000+05:302008-08-30T01:13:00.000+05:30Because Sujai would like it if India takes care of...<I>Because Sujai would like it if India takes care of Kashmiri Pandits. Sujai would have more respect for India knowing that it is ready to take care of its people.</I><BR/><BR/>Must be a recent development that concern for Kashmiri Hindus rose up Sujai's list of priorities, because that concern is definitely not reflected in the number of posts on this blog.<BR/>Der aaye durust aaye. :)<BR/>-chirkutAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-50691383501376971612008-08-29T13:04:00.000+05:302008-08-29T13:04:00.000+05:30It is because of the fear of losing muslim votes a...<I>It is because of the fear of losing muslim votes and appeasing seculars like Sujai.</I><BR/><BR/>Then they got the whole reading very wrong. Because Sujai would like it if India takes care of Kashmiri Pandits. Sujai would have more respect for India knowing that it is ready to take care of its people.Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-69327061448386817952008-08-29T12:43:00.000+05:302008-08-29T12:43:00.000+05:30Why didn't India not take care of Kashmiri Pandits...<I> Why didn't India not take care of Kashmiri Pandits? </I><BR/><BR/>It is because of the fear of losing muslim votes and appeasing seculars like Sujai.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-30330179310004858632008-08-29T03:51:00.000+05:302008-08-29T03:51:00.000+05:30HiReferendem:The conditions to hold referendem are...Hi<BR/>Referendem:The conditions to hold referendem are no support for cross border terrorism and no terror camps in the valley.Refer to Security advisor recent comments on the no of camps operating on pakistan soil.<BR/>I do not see the present kind of psuedo secular,minority governments can handle these camps.<BR/>We do not have money like China to influence the politics of the other countries.We do not have the resolve like Turkey to nutralise the camps.<BR/><BR/>Seconly,Kashmiris have participated in indian elections several times expressing their belief in the system.<BR/><BR/>Thirdly,Look at the plight of muslims who crossed the border.they are still treated like outsiders.Visit MQM website once.<BR/><BR/>See how the muslims of Afganisthan border are treated by the dominant muslims of Punjab.<BR/><BR/>Compensation:money is not the only issue,Why any body need to leave their birth place(and thier parents for generations) because some people can torture them.<BR/><BR/>If kashmiri muslims feel they are indians they sholud lean to live in a secular democratic country.<BR/>If they think they belong to other country,the border they should cross the border.<BR/><BR/>I know the terrorists are blowing the buses between kashmir and occupied kashmir,I do not hear any kashmiri has migrated(like KP),or killed by terrorists while crossing to the land of pure(jihadis?)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-38294906602202686432008-08-28T22:41:00.000+05:302008-08-28T22:41:00.000+05:30"Most young people wake up suddenly, in far away p..."Most young people wake up suddenly, in far away places, and start believing that the struggle in that valley is everything to do with religion." <BR/>Yeah, and I'm one of those misguided souls who just woke up from their sleep and realized Kashmir's existence isn't it? ;-)<BR/><BR/>Kashmir's economy is underdeveloped alright, but the people there are better off (economically) than many other Indian states.ragshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04206768079226759526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-26815919890984772612008-08-28T21:37:00.000+05:302008-08-28T21:37:00.000+05:30Rags:Why didn't India not take care of Kashmiri Pa...Rags:<BR/><BR/>Why didn't India not take care of Kashmiri Pandits? Was it waiting for Kashmiri Muslims to send the funds as compensation? <BR/><BR/>India has nearly 300 Billion dollars sitting in foreign exchange. It is not a poor country anymore. So, how come India did not take those initiatives. <BR/><BR/>Is the compensation so important that unless Kashmiri Pandits are compensated by Kashmiri Muslims, India will not discuss their autonomy or freedoms? <BR/><BR/>How come no government, even BJP and NDA, which shed crocodile tears for the plight of Kashmiri Pandits, never stepped forward to take care of Kashmiri Pandits. Were they all waiting for Kashmiri Muslims to pay up?<BR/><BR/><I>but I do feel a great sense of injustice that KPs who were driven away from their homes by KMs have to be compensated by Indians.</I><BR/><BR/>Your feelings are completely misplaced. The more you speak it shows how less you understand of Kashmir, its composition, the economic status of its people, the representation in education and employment, those important factors which cannot be ignored. <BR/><BR/>Most young people wake up suddenly, in far away places, and start believing that the struggle in that valley is everything to do with religion. <BR/><BR/>The plight of Kashmiri Hindus can easily be handled by India if it has a desire. Instead of waiting for 'justice' to happen, India should step forward and take care of its people - if it thinks they are its people. <BR/><BR/>Seeking reparations from Kashmiri Muslims, whose economy is in shambles, thanks to many years of Indian occupation, is not an important topic to hold off solving Kashmir problem.<BR/><BR/>Its like stalling India's Independence because it is waiting for India to send the required funds to Pakistan. <BR/><BR/>No exodus, even if it forced, has resulted in compensations.Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-70820203477774486032008-08-28T20:20:00.000+05:302008-08-28T20:20:00.000+05:30Yeah sujai, if someone agrees with you they are ra...Yeah sujai, if someone agrees with you they are rational and balanced, if not they are irrational and unbalanced. ;-)<BR/><BR/>Anyway, you can rationalize it whichever way you want by citing partition but I do feel a great sense of injustice that KPs who were driven away from their homes by KMs have to be compensated by Indians. Yes, Indians do have the responsibility of rehabilitating the Pundits, but KMs just can't wash their hands off them.ragshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04206768079226759526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-19615181877688465622008-08-28T14:29:00.000+05:302008-08-28T14:29:00.000+05:30Rags:You got your answer. If the Kashmiris favour ...Rags:<BR/><I>You got your answer. If the Kashmiris favour Pakistan they can pack their bags and leave for the land of "pure". Indians do not have a problem with that.</I><BR/><BR/>It would be a wise idea to know the composition of the valley at different points of time. It will give you a perspective on making a sound argument. Otherwise, it will look like an argument for the sake of argument!<BR/><BR/><I>Besides why should I see it your way?</I><BR/><BR/>You don't have to. For a while, you sounded balanced and rational and that's the only reason I am entertaining this discussion! ;-)<BR/><BR/><BR/><I>By the above reasoning you are actually legitimising the discrimination of Kashmiri Pundits by saying it is all part of the greater task of Partition,</I><BR/><BR/>I am not legitimizing the the actions that led to mass migration of Pandits out of the valley. I am not legitimizing the targeted killings of Hindus in Kashmir Valley.<BR/><BR/>Taking care of Kashmiri Hindu Pandits is India's responsibility. India cannot shirk from its responsibility. <BR/><BR/><I>So who should compensate the KPs?</I><BR/><BR/>India.Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-10156708270288917052008-08-28T13:35:00.000+05:302008-08-28T13:35:00.000+05:30"Are we just interested in the land but not the pe..."Are we just interested in the land but not the people residing on it?"<BR/><BR/>You got your answer. If the Kashmiris favour Pakistan they can pack their bags and leave for the land of "pure". Indians do not have a problem with that. <BR/><BR/>"The minute you talk about morality, it is a never ending game. Think this way- what happened to millions of Hindus who migrated from Pakistan during Partition? Did all those Hindus get compensated? "<BR/>During partition, BOTH Hindus and Muslims crossed borders and both of them lost their lands and livelihoods. However in Kashmir only the pundits have been systematically discriminated for several years and thrown out. There is no comparison here. Besides why should I see it your way? It certainly is a most twisted way of viewing things. By the above reasoning you are actually legitimising the discrimination of Kashmiri Pundits by saying it is all part of the greater task of Partition, so KMs are actually justified in kicking out the KPs, they are just doing what Partition did to their other Muslim brothers. <BR/><BR/>So who should compensate the KPs? Or should they just be left to their fate? You talk so much about the rights of Kashmiri Muslims, what about the rights of Kashmiri Pundits?ragshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04206768079226759526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-37296693841104036522008-08-28T10:20:00.000+05:302008-08-28T10:20:00.000+05:30Rags:Yeah right, Mr.thinking box. We'll apply your...Rags:<BR/><BR/><I>Yeah right, Mr.thinking box. We'll apply your logic here and give Kashmir independence. We don't have to stop with Kashmir, we'll do that to every other region having separatist claims, after all if people don't want to be part of India they shouldn't be forced to right? </I><BR/><BR/>Absolutely! ;-)<BR/><BR/><I>BTW,the kashmiris have no moral right to talk bout azadi until they have compensated the Hindu pandits.</I><BR/><BR/>The minute you talk about morality, it is a never ending game. We will go back to the roots of the problem and there is no end in sight. <BR/><BR/>Think this way- what happened to millions of Hindus who migrated from Pakistan during Partition? Did all those Hindus get compensated? Not really. Why not? It was an exercise that had to be done during Partition and we did it. Millions lost their lands, fields, farms and wealth, and yet no country compensated them for it. Imagine Kashmir is still an unresolved issue from Partition and now think back and ask the same question.Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-68115850968933877592008-08-28T10:14:00.000+05:302008-08-28T10:14:00.000+05:30Vishal:I am curious. Are you in favor of holding a...Vishal:<BR/><I>I am curious. Are you in favor of holding a referendum in Kashmir?</I><BR/><BR/>I think I have discussed this topic in detail on my blog. Kashmir I-VII. <BR/><BR/>Greater autonomy, independence, are some of the options I prefer. I also believe that the state should be seen as three distinct regions.<BR/><BR/><I>If so, what do you think about the consequences? Communal backlash, national integrity (other states might start secessionist demands), security concerns etc.</I><BR/><BR/>I don't think that these are real concerns. I think they are all imaginary concerns. <BR/><BR/>The real concern is if India is confident enough to take bold decisions. Or is it shit scared? <BR/>The real concern is that India and Indians are really insecure about their own country. They think that the idea called India is so fragile that a single act of good faith will somehow crumble the idea called India like a pack of cards. <BR/><BR/>On the other hand, I think India is much stronger than what many people believe. We live here in spite of many options we have. We really believe in the idea called India, and we are fighting our case to make this nation better, because we all believe in it, not because we have no options, not because we have other alternatives. <BR/><BR/>There are enough number of people in India who have not given up on India, and they will continue to hold India together. It is in their interest to be part of India, and they will continue to do so without the a gun pointed at their head. <BR/><BR/>Security? What security? National security? If one can defend such a fragile region as Siachen Glacier, why can we defend the plains. It is much easier to defend the plains than the mountains any day. <BR/><BR/>If other states demand secession, what can one do about it? Do you really think India is held together only because of fear- that India somehow keeps itself together by keeping half a million army forces in each state? <BR/><BR/>North-east is definitely a big problem. But it is not related to Kashmir. Our policies in North-east are independent of Kashmir. We really botched our job there. We will have to face the reality someday or the other. May be, we are waiting for a large scale massacres to happen before we move start changing our policies in those regions. <BR/><BR/>Communal backlash? Who will backlash against who? On what pretext? <BR/><BR/>The real consequence is that India will be absolved of many duties that it is now extending on the name of holding territorial integrity which is flawed to start with. Are we just interested in the land but not the people residing on it?<BR/><BR/>India has to sober up, become mature, and start acting like a rational adult instead of a bigoted loony high on opium.Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-52196977906389811872008-08-28T09:08:00.000+05:302008-08-28T09:08:00.000+05:30"I don’t think Pakistan is not a good example for ..."I don’t think Pakistan is not a good example for India to emulate."<BR/>Sounds very logical isn't it?<BR/><BR/>Yeah right, Mr.thinking box. We'll apply your logic here and give Kashmir independence. We don't have to stop with Kashmir, we'll do that to every other region having separatist claims, after all if people don't want to be part of India they shouldn't be forced to right? <BR/>BTW,the kashmiris have no moral right to talk bout azadi until they have compensated the Hindu pandits.ragshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04206768079226759526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-33298169188395928292008-08-28T05:16:00.000+05:302008-08-28T05:16:00.000+05:30Sujai,I am curious. Are you in favor of holding a ...Sujai,<BR/><BR/>I am curious. Are you in favor of holding a referendum in Kashmir? (It sounds like it, but you didn't spell it out.) If so, what do you think about the consequences? Communal backlash, national integrity (other states might start secessionist demands), security concerns etc.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-5774593372445990212008-08-27T16:14:00.000+05:302008-08-27T16:14:00.000+05:30a secular state does not mean it has to treat diff...a secular state does not mean it has to treat different religious group equally.. it means it should not care for religion at all.<BR/>secularism & democracy is too important a trait that it cant be given into just bcos we have an angry irrational mob in our hands and our politician only knows ad hoc solutions.<BR/>addressing and acknowledging religious identity is opening a can of worms. irrationality, myths, religious sentiments and many such worms are kept away from government only by secularism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-51566505105355565412008-08-27T10:57:00.000+05:302008-08-27T10:57:00.000+05:30Rags:Pakistanis can proudly proclaim they are Isla...Rags:<BR/><BR/><I>Pakistanis can proudly proclaim they are Islamic, Kashmiris can scream all they want about establishing an Islamic state, but the poor guy cannot show any sort of support to people from his own religion because, unfortuanately he is part of a 'secular' country and any support shown to Hindus amounts to Hindutva and religious extremism.</I><BR/><BR/>Yes. That is what I ask of this country. If India wants to emulate Pakistan the way you described, I completely oppose it. I don’t think Pakistan is not a good example for India to emulate. If its standards are so low, I am not really happy about it.<BR/><BR/><I>We should just emulate our Muslim neighbours and declare India a Hindu state. </I><BR/><BR/>We differ in our expectations from this nation. I don’t want us to be foolish just because our neighbors are.<BR/><BR/><I> We should come to terms with the fact that the Kashmiris want an Islamic nation.</I><BR/><BR/>On the other hand, I think all they want is freedom. <BR/><BR/><I>Somehow when Hindus applied the same logic to Muslim majority Kashmir (where minorities were systematically persecuted), it was called the will of the majority!</I><BR/><BR/>I am not justifying what Kashmiri Muslims did to Kashmiri Hindus. Just because they have done it does not mean we have to do the same to them. In the end innocent people die no matter who does it.<BR/><BR/><I>If we want to apply that logic here shouldn't Hindus (who are the largest religious group in India) ask for India to be declared a Hindu nation (they are the majority after all). </I><BR/><BR/>Leave logic to people who can think! ;-) <BR/><BR/>Reread what I wrote. I was quite sure someone would make such an unrelated conclusion as you did. And hence I clarified how India can work with religious groups without having to resort to combining state with religion.<BR/><BR/><I><B>"Indians think that identifying a human as male or female would make the state masculine or feminine".</B> <BR/>This made no sense to me at all.</I><BR/><BR/>Of course it didn’t make sense – that’s why you came to unrelated conclusion I cited above. Basic prerequisite for applying logic is that it is done by a thinking box! ;-)Sujaihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16539694685428659940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-82349272035603442572008-08-27T04:32:00.000+05:302008-08-27T04:32:00.000+05:30Dear Rajeeve chelanat:What part of the language tr...Dear Rajeeve chelanat:<BR/><BR/>What part of the language troubled yoy and why?Can you please give some feedback.<BR/><BR/>Gopal: there is a commentery on BBC South asia on different solutions.You may be interested in it.<BR/><BR/>Anonymous: Thanks for the linkAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-8620556064836169462008-08-26T21:40:00.000+05:302008-08-26T21:40:00.000+05:30the myth of the economic blockage,spread by the 's...the myth of the economic blockage,spread by the 'seculars' like sujai<BR/><BR/> http://www.frontlineonnet.com/stories/20080912251801000.htm<BR/><BR/>not that it will do anything to opne the eyes of rabid secularists but the secular and islamic lies have to countered.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21825668.post-68826186817703516832008-08-26T20:27:00.000+05:302008-08-26T20:27:00.000+05:30Some blogger had given 3 options for this mess. Ha...Some blogger had given 3 options for this mess. Have a referendum and let Kashmiris decide:<BR/><BR/>a: Join Pakistan<BR/>b: Be with India<BR/>c: Be independent.<BR/><BR/>In thge garb of being secular the Hindu majority is being trampled upon and who cares how many Hindus die.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com