Friday, June 13, 2008

Telangana VIII: You need to make a case

Seekers of Hyderabad State, you need to make a case

Saying that you are well-off and hence you want to be separated from a region that is backward because you do not wish to share your riches with them does not make a case. That way every metropolitan city in India has a case to become a separate state.

In fact, your case is duplicitous to start with.

First, you were not willing to give us a separate state. You bludgeoned each of our requests, agitations and protests. You rubbished each of our efforts to create a state for ourselves. You became the very masters that you opposed. You created your new state away from Madras Presidency citing you will not be well-represented under Tamils. But you imposed the very ill-representation onto us.

Now, when we are on the verge of attaining our statehood, you want to weaken us taking away our main city on which the entire economy depends. Now, you ask for a separate Hyderabad state.

Your case is quite flimsy and is fraught with greed, selfishness and extreme self-centeredness. These are the very attributes you are accused of, and which you feared from Madras Presidency back in 1950s.

Case for Pakistan

When Indian sub-continent got its Independence, the Muslims of India made a case, and though many of us disagreed with it, they bargained their position to create a new country for some Muslims. Their case was simple. Muslims will not be given the same privileges and will not have the same status as Hindus in a country where Hindus are in majority. So, when this subcontinent was given independence by British, certain portions of the land were designated for them, and many Muslims living in India moved out to those lands.

When Nizam of Hyderabad and some Muslims of Hyderabad state wanted to belong to Pakistan, they had an option. They could migrate to Pakistan. But India was not going to have a Pakistan right in the middle of its country. Geographical proximity was an essential criterion.

Case for Andhra Pradesh

Andhra Pradesh was formed because people of Andhra did not feel they would be well-represented in Madras Presidency. Though there was no precedent to verify whether they would be marginalized or not, there was enough support for creation of a new Andhra Pradesh for its people. Andhra Pradesh was created out by breaking Madras Presidency.

Telangana was broken out of Hyderabad State and was added to Andhra Pradesh against its wishes. While Andhra was under British, and hence had access to better education and opportunities to start with, Telangana under Nizam was quite backward with very high illiteracy and poverty. The new state required Telugu and English, and people of Telangana were educated in neither.

People of Telangana, which includes people of Hyderabad, protested against such inclusion. In fact, the city of Hyderabad saw protests against joining the new state of Andhra Pradesh where few protestors were killed. It is ironical that the very city which saw protests against joining Andhra Pradesh is now being hijacked by the very people that these Telangana people feared.

Telangana people felt exactly the same way people of Andhra felt about Tamils. Telangana people reasoned they would not be well-represented in the new state. They felt that people of Andhra would dominate and take up most of the jobs, because they were richer, had better access to opportunity, well-educated and more prosperous.

Case for Telangana

The case for Telangana, which includes Hyderabad as its center, was always valid from the time of inception of the state. The first SRC clearly indicated that it was a marriage of unequal regions. Though many promises were made to alleviate the needs of Telangana people, none were met. Later in 1969, a massive agitation took place in Telangana asking for a separate state. Though there were many promises made for welfare of Telangana, almost all of those proposals were struck down. No promises were kept. To add to the incompetency and betrayal of its own leaders, the greed, the selfishness and self-centeredness of the rest of Andhra came out baring its ugly teeth. Time and again people of Telangana were denied their statehood.

Now, when the time has come to redeem our pledge and ensure we create a new state for our people, they talk about taking away its crown jewel.

What is the case for new state called Hyderabad carved out of the city lying in the middle of Telangana? Does it make sense?

When I started writing about Telangana, my premise was this:

When one state has two economically and culturally different regions, one being prosperous and the other backward, if corrective measures are not taken to uplift that backward region, there is a great danger that only the prosperous region gets all the attention, funding, new industries, canals, and opportunities, while the people of backward region keep losing out, even in their own region. When such a condition prevails far too long, strong corrective measures are to be taken, and if that does not work, a new state is one of the best solutions.

In what way does Hyderabad qualify for a separate statehood?

Were the people of Hyderabad oppressed, marginalized by Telangana? Is the representation of Hyderabad city people less compared to rest of Telangana, or is it more? Are the people of Hyderabad less educated compared to rest of Telangana, or more? What historical precedence shows that people of Hyderabad were marginalized, less represented, are economically backward or different or distinct in culture or heritage from Telangana? Is being too prosperous a good enough reason for exclusion, or inclusion?

There is no case of creating Hyderabad into a new state cutting it away from Telangana. If being prosperous, well-off, and being highly developed, and having many immigrants are good enough reasons to create every city into a state then each metropolitan city of India qualifies for it. Bangalore, Mumbai, Chennai, etc, can all be made new states cutting them away from their original states.

The greed of people is showing off. And we have institutionalized the greed so much, that they are not even squeamish to flaunt it.

If you think you will not be well-represented in the new state, you always have an option. If I am an immigrant and I don’t think I am well-represented in that land, I always have a choice to go back to the lands where I came from.

And in case, you believe you belong to Telangana, I suggest you wait for few years, and see how new Telangana treats you. We waited for more than 50 years to see how new Andhra Pradesh would treat us.

And if it turns out that people of Hyderabad are marginalized in the new state of Telangana just because they belong to a city called Hyderabad, I suggest you should fight for a new state called Hyderabad.

Frankly, deriding Telangana people will not help your case at all. Look at what one of detractors to a separate Telangana has to say (I take an extreme example here). I see this all the time. The detractors like to reduce Telangana Movement to a joke, deriding its leaders, its people, its culture, and of course, its language.

U r such a shameless fellow u can accept a muslims as ur brothers. U fought against razakkars, the Nizam king made ur women to
dance nude for batukamma,
the hyderabdi nizam want to join in "Pakistan" and u people without any shame say brothers to those guys
because u know if u don't say brothers they won't support Hyderabad to be in Telangana. Shame on you.

15 comments:

  1. ourtelangana.comJune 27, 2008 7:54 PM

    Wonderful blogs.Please join us at ourtelangana.com.We need your input their.

    ReplyDelete
  2. You are a educated Idoit Sujai. Just to prove ur point the last para of u topic is a cut and pasted from a discussion which was happening between "Hyd State" and "Anonymous..."
    Read it and then cut and paste.

    "Anonymous" was absolutely right.He said if u want a state take it and u don't need to say "Andhrite..Go back".Why don't u follow that.
    In ur first "Topic" in a discussion with kuffir u said "Attend a meeting held by TRS to know what is people wish".

    And just after byelections u say "TRS is not Telanagana movement".It is just carrying fwd. this movenment.U ass holes will never understand that these
    selfish leaders are making their position strong.We are ready to give u the state but as many people has said and asked will u stop saying "Andhrite Go back??"

    Don't u call this "Excessive Regoinalism".When Mumbai guys asked "North Indians " to go back why u wrote a topic "Excessive Regionalism"..If its comes
    to you then its rite else it wrong.Shame on You.

    ~sudhir

    ReplyDelete
  3. Sujai,

    I agree with "Sudhir".You did a wrong thing by pasting the last part in your topic.The discussion raised when "Hyd state.."said muslims
    and Northies are our brothers u andhra guys are brothels".
    Every where about telanagan u say we shud respect people feelings.."We shud give Telangana because people want it".

    Nothing is done according to people feelings/will/wish in India.When Hyderabad Nizam wanted to join Pakistan why we supressed his wish and
    applied our force to join India? When people are crying not to break Ram sethu why we still going ahead with it? When Mumbai guys asked "NorthIndians"
    to leave why we said "Excessive Regionalism". I think this is the only issue where ur "Matured Thinking" has beed overrided by "People's Sentiment".

    Is Telangana really that much backward? The towns of Telangana are developed.Its only the interior villages. Do u think its only telangana interiors which are not developed
    then go around the country and see.Don't see the towns.Every state has this problem.What we are going to get by getting a state? The answer will be [b]self rule[/b].Now if u
    talk to people first they want is food and water.Will this be solved in 1 yr if state is formed ? No never.First try to give their basic needs.Educate them on their basic needs.
    Only state will never help.Being a capital of state "Hyderabad" is not helping in development of Telangana districts what difference it will have being "Telangana State capital" ?
    Even now the revenue generated here is not used for other purposes like developing areas?Do you think revenue generated here(Hyderabad) is been used in developing andhra region.
    Can you show me any source which states this ?

    Regards
    KK

    ReplyDelete
  4. KK:

    I agree with "Sudhir".You did a wrong thing by pasting the last part in your topic.The discussion raised when "Hyd state.."said muslims
    and Northies are our brothers u andhra guys are brothels".


    Yes, I don't think I should have pasted that taking out of the context.

    ReplyDelete
  5. KK:

    Nothing is done according to people feelings/will/wish in India.

    If so, should we continue to ignore people's wishes even if they are legitimate?


    When Hyderabad Nizam wanted to join Pakistan why we supressed his wish and applied our force to join India?

    You are giving a wrong example here to prove India ignores people's wishes.

    In fact, the whole idea Junagadh and Hyderabad were annexed into India was using the pretext that its 'people wanted to be with India' though the ruled opted for something else.

    Nizam wanted to be independent (and during the last days expressed interest to join Pakistan), but still India ignored his demands citing the reasons that 'its people wanted to be with India'.

    When people are crying not to break Ram sethu why we still going ahead with it?


    That's because their crying is illegitimate and unreasonable founded in blind belief, superstition and complete gobbledygook.

    If majority of Indians believe they should not send rockets into space because it would disturb Lord Vishnu who is sleeping the heavens, India should ignore such beliefs and still go ahead and send rockets. That's because their reasons for objecting are founded in completely nonsensical belief systems.

    Is Telangana really that much backward?

    Yes!

    What we are going to get by getting a state?

    The same thing that India got in 1947. Self-rule.

    The answer will be self rule.

    I am not sure why you asked the question since you already knew the answer.

    Now if u talk to people first they want is food and water.Will this be solved in 1 yr if state is formed?

    Food and water was always the need. Did India solve this problem within 1st year of Independence?

    First try to give their basic needs.Educate them on their basic needs.

    So, did India try to give basic needs and education to all its states before it formed its states?

    Only state will never help.

    True. Who said separate Telangana is going solve all the problems?

    Being a capital of state "Hyderabad" is not helping in development of Telangana districts what difference it will have being "Telangana State capital" ?

    Who said that 'Hyderabad' is panacea to all problems? Its your assumption that we fighting for Telangana to get Hyderabad. Wrong Assumption.

    Can you show me any source which states this ?

    ;-)
    Well! We are not trying to prove anything here. We are just fighting for a separate state - all within the legal framework of India.

    Did Andhra people have any sources to cite to demand a separate state from Madras Presidency?

    ReplyDelete
  6. Sujai,

    My question was People in telangana feel hyderabd revenue is been utilised to develop other areas.I asked any source of info to prove this.You got me wrong!!!

    If u see the towns in telangana they too are devloped its only the interiors which is not developed.This is not only in Telangana every state has this issue.Why to go to other state see the interirors of srikakulam,vizianagaram,cuddapah kurnool,east and west godavari.I can show u some place in west godavari whihc can be reached only thru boats...What to say about this?

    Yes I repeat nothing happens in India according to peoples wish.We want our basic amenities like food ,water and shelter.The govt. offices shud work without corruption,the cost shud be in control etc etc.No one cares about this.When people asked u not to give sarcastic answers or do excessive criticism of Indians u still continued :)

    When u cud not change urself and give respect to people feelings how can u expect others to understand "People Sentiment" for Telangana.

    What big difference we will have if have "SELF RULE" without all these.


    Regards
    KK

    ReplyDelete
  7. Did Andhra people have any sources to cite to demand a separate state from Madras Presidency?

    I missed out this in ur above post.I read many times people in this BLOG(including u sujai)saying "Why hyderabad shud not be separated from Telangana " and u give the example of separate state of Andhra.All the covering notes for including hyderabad with Telangana is because historically and geographically hyderabad is in Telangana.At the same time u say if for Identity and self rule andhra people get separated from Madras provincy why can't we get separated from AP.

    Ok good u can get separated.But can u follow the same thing what andhrites did ?The movement started with "Madras Mandee".Geographically and historically madras was andhra's but at last just for separate state they left madras to Tamilnadu.Can u do it ?Canu leave hyderabad as separate state.I don't say give it to Andhrites or raylseema guys.

    U people justify that our fight is for telangana and not for Hyderabad.Many T people want hyderabad thats the only reason why the movement has started again.

    Will self rule won't come into effect in Telangana regions if hyderabad is excluded? U r whole cry is for Telangana backwardness then u can still form a separate state with all these backward region.And I feel the problem will be solved immediately if u say Telangana without hyderabad.

    Let hyderabad be out of every other new state which is formed.Lets make it a new state.Smaller state concept.There is no hard and fast rule that only these many districts shud form a state rite? So let go ahead. No issues for me.

    Note:Neither I am against Telangana movement nor supporting it.After many discussions I feel this will be the proper solution for this problem.I know many people won't support this but i can't help.With so much animosity for people of other regions lets do this.

    Regards
    KK

    ReplyDelete
  8. KK:

    You say:
    Many T people want hyderabad thats the only reason why the movement has started again.

    That is patently wrong to assume the above. You make your whole discussion futile by making such ridiculous assumptions.

    Reading the history of Telangana or Andhra Pradesh, it is clear that a movement for Telangana existed even when there was no discussion for removing Hyderabad out of Telangana.

    In fact, the first protests against inclusion of Telangana into Andhra Pradesh came out in the city of Hyderabad itself where few protesters were shot down.

    Its like saying, people of India wanted independence from British only to get New Delhi - sounds ridiculous, isn't it?

    ReplyDelete
  9. Sujai,

    Read it properly.I used the word "Again". I never said 'T' movement never exists.After 1969 everyone kept quiet.Even though people had the desire there was no movement. I am not criticising the movement or people's sentiment. I only say why can't we make hyderabad out of everything.Which is a valid one.U started the topic with smaller states good for adminsitration and so on..then why can't this rule be applicable for hyderabad?

    Our main desire of new state is for remove the backwradness and "SELF RULE".Can't we have self rule in Telangana without hyderabad?

    Regards
    KK

    ReplyDelete
  10. KK:
    Can't we have self rule in Telangana without hyderabad?

    The idea is clearly discussed in this article and the previous one. Reread the reasons.

    ReplyDelete
  11. In principle, there is no end to individual or group will and wishes/demands being 'honoured' by yielding to them. What is done merely to respect the dignity of individuals or groups may not stand the test of such act maximizing the good for the maximum numbers. At a national level, a certain amount of coercion, even ruthlessness, are a practical need in many situations, as is some sacrifice on the part of constitutent groups in a nation. The democratic rights of which we talk as inalienable rights, are really not so, unless there is an undercurrent racial or religious, linguistic, or other common factor operating. In unity lies strength. The United States is powerful, strong because it is united, and will remain so in future, since the forefathers of this nation found it wise to give a decisive role for force and coercion in consolidating nationhood, and subsequently by enacting laws to integrate society regardless of various factors of distinction most notably blacks/ white.

    Taking Telengana, well, or for that matter many other parts within present States of India, which demand a separate identity as 'state', in principle, it may be good to constitutionally bring about administrative autonomy. However this autonomy should be within an India in which a second state reorganization is done, in which languages are ignored as the basis of states, but the country is divided by longtitudes and latitudes forming approximately equal areas. India is racially relatively homogeneous (ignoring hair splitting and never ending Aryan/Dravidian racialism). In fact this includes even Pakistan and Bangladesh. For a beginning, however, we need only to restrict to a reorganization within the existing entity called India.

    What is worth discussing, once we grant the kind of autonomy for closer addressing of problems with a more localized focus, will be to maximize the use of resources like water, coal, iron and other ores, and so on, without any reference to language, religion, or irrelevant factors. Certainly linguistic reorganization of the country has not yielded much meaningful benefits to us. Other negative results, which were never bargained for, only have accumulated as a result of using language as a basis for states. By way of illustration of the evil results of linguistic reorganization, an example is, proliferation of too many periodicals managed by people of dubious commitment to social upliftment with healthy entertainment, popularization of science along with a modicum of spiritual values of life. How did Telugu and Tamil grow, so well, in pre Independence centuries, even when there had been great cross movements of Telugus and Tamils ? And similarly, Kannada and Tamil ? And Kannada and Marathi ?

    ReplyDelete
  12. Man! that was a cleverly misguided argument again. The reason for asking a separate Union Territory for Hyderabad is not that the people are being distinguished or discriminated. The city of Hyderabad has been developed by all the regions of the state to a level that it cannot belong to any single region of Andhra Pradesh. Since it belongs to everyone, everyone must have the fruits of the hardwork. If we argue along the lines of backwardness, conclusions like this will only result.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Chandra:

    The city of Hyderabad has been developed by all the regions of the state to a level that it cannot belong to any single region of Andhra Pradesh. Since it belongs to everyone, everyone must have the fruits of the hardwork. If we argue along the lines of backwardness, conclusions like this will only result.

    City of Mumbai has been developed by all the regions of our country to a level that it cannot belong to any single region or state. Since it belongs to everyone, everyone must have the fruits of the hard work. Therefore, Mumbai must be converted into a Union Territory right away.

    Oh, BTW, the same argument holds good for Chennai. The same for Bangalore. The same for Kolkata. Let’s convert all our cities into Union Territories

    ;-)

    ReplyDelete
  14. What is the problem with leaving Hyderabad to AP and not part of the new Telangana state ? Not questioning the motives, just asking out of general curiosity...

    ReplyDelete
  15. /*Therefore, Mumbai must be converted into a Union Territory right away. */

    no one is asking to leave Mumbai and calling others settlers though some incidents happened in the past by shiv sena, when such incidents increase we may see similar demands for Mumbai and other cities too.

    ReplyDelete

Dear Commenters:
Please identify yourself. At least use a pseudonym. Otherwise there will be too many *Anonymous*; making it confusing.

Do NOT write personal information or whereabouts about the author or other commenters. You are free to write about yourself. Please do not use abusive language. Do not indulge in personal attacks and insults.

Write comments which are relevant and make sense so that the debate remains healthy.